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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???



 
 
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  #1  
Old February 17th 05, 12:07 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
JC
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 98
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

Hi all,

Let me straight off the bat state that I am a ****ed off Plusnet customer.

I have been with them for a year or so no, having migrated from BTOpenworld
and was *absolutely* sold a monthly contract unlimited service and had this
confirmed on numerous occasions. By unlimited, I understood this to mean
that I could download as much as I wanted within the physical constraints
of the transport mechanism

I'm not one of the "bad boys" and possibly won't be too affected by their
caps. I do download a bit of bittorrent p2p, mainly TV programmes like CSI,
Enterprise & Stargate Atlantis...however I do use VOIP from home. I am a
home-based worker and I use a corporate soft-phone. I also have a wireless
network with another 3 PCs attached, though traffic usage on these is very
low.

I can *kind of* see why they are introducing caps..it is the way they have
gone about it, that has really ****ed me off. It is almost as if they made
a determined effort to antagonise their customers.

They embarked on a "fixed" survey
Published the results and made them look as if the users had approved of
them
They then completely ignored these results and introduced caps, roughly
half of the limits in the survey.

Then in a blatantly dishonest manner, they have tried to use a real cloak
and mirror act to state that these caps are in no way a change of existing
T&Cs, merely a clarification..though there is no mention at all, of any
sort of Fair Usage in the T&Cs for them to clarify.....besides T&Cs..to the
best of my knowledge can not be legally "clarified" or embelished..the
appropriate level of detail should be there to begin with.

So, do I take my custom elsewhere or just accept that I am paying my money
to a dishonest company?

Well, I had a long chat with Zen this morning and the guy trotted out the
company line that "We have no plans for any bandwidth cap at the moment"
and indeed, the website clearly states "no bandwidth cap"

However, during the course of this conversation, I asked what would likely
happen if, together with the advent of MaxDSL, Zen found themselves
inheriting masses of users, expecting to be able to download 500Gb of files
every month..and he admitted that if this were to happen, Zen would likely
be reluctantly forced to take actions to ensure the viability of the
service for the majority of their users.

And therein lies the problem...If I migrate from PN, will I be jumping out
of the frying pan into the fire??

I am frankly disgusted with PN's actions throughout this whole debacle, but
as the "I'm alright Jack" faction have been professing, it's my money and I
use it where it is most effective *for me*.

Does that mean that I will ever trust PN again...unlikely.
Does it mean that I will tell people what I think of my ISP if
asked...absolutely
Would I recommend PN as a reputable ISP...NO!!
Will I be migrating away on a point of principle?.....Only if whatever deal
I find is better *for me*

YMMV
--

Regards

John [Essex, UK]
Remove the obvious spamtrap to reply
  #2  
Old February 17th 05, 12:26 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Markus G. Klötzer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 35
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

JC johncalias-newsgroupsATyahooD0TcoD0Tuk wrote:

And therein lies the problem...If I migrate from PN, will I be jumping out
of the frying pan into the fire??



yes - at least for any other BT-based breadband access in the UK

cu

mgk
--
Send virus warnings?

http://ars.userfriendly.org/cartoons/?id=20000512
  #3  
Old February 17th 05, 01:22 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andrew Norman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 96
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 12:07:27 +0000, JC
johncalias-newsgroupsATyahooD0TcoD0Tuk wrote:

And therein lies the problem...If I migrate from PN, will I be jumping out
of the frying pan into the fire??


It all comes down to money in the end. If a company gets enough high
volume users so that it starts seriously impacting their income from
the service then they will have to take action one way or another. I
personally think the Plusnet "solution" of caps is better than the
approach other ISPs like BT have taken in the past, where they just
expell the users they don't like.

People like AOL and ntl seem to be the exception to this rule. I
suspect AOL are too big to notice the heavy users, ntl are too
disorganised to realise they are there...

I am frankly disgusted with PN's actions throughout this whole debacle, but
as the "I'm alright Jack" faction have been professing, it's my money and I
use it where it is most effective *for me*.


While I think the Plusnet caps are the right way to go I do agree that
the way they have gone about it has been, how shall I put it, silly...

I have never got the impression that there was anything malicious
about their actions, just mis-guided and not so well thought out from
a presentational point of view.

Will I be migrating away on a point of principle?.....Only if whatever deal
I find is better *for me*


Couldn't have put it better.

I am currently on Lite and the fact that uploads and over night
downloads come off my total has always annoyed me. When the new regime
comes I will be moving to the lowest cost Premier option.
--
Andy Norman
http://www.norman.cx/
Replace the fish with my first name to reply
  #4  
Old February 17th 05, 01:31 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Richard Sobey
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 234
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:22:17 +0000, Andrew Norman
wrote:

I am currently on Lite and the fact that uploads and over night
downloads come off my total has always annoyed me. When the new regime
comes I will be moving to the lowest cost Premier option.


I'm playing the cyncic here, but I am going to assume that a lot of
people take advantage of the 1am-8am "download what you like it wont
go toward your usage" thing. I wonder what the result of that will
be...
  #5  
Old February 17th 05, 01:46 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andrew Norman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 96
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:31:18 +0000, Richard Sobey
wrote:

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:22:17 +0000, Andrew Norman
wrote:

I am currently on Lite and the fact that uploads and over night
downloads come off my total has always annoyed me. When the new regime
comes I will be moving to the lowest cost Premier option.


I'm playing the cyncic here, but I am going to assume that a lot of
people take advantage of the 1am-8am "download what you like it wont
go toward your usage" thing. I wonder what the result of that will
be...


I had been wondering that too. I expect my usage to go up, I'll be
paying a couple of extra quid most months though as well.
--
Andy Norman
http://www.norman.cx/
Replace the fish with my first name to reply
  #6  
Old February 17th 05, 02:13 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Ian Stirling
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 807
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

Markus G. Kl?tzer wrote:
JC johncalias-newsgroupsATyahooD0TcoD0Tuk wrote:

And therein lies the problem...If I migrate from PN, will I be jumping out
of the frying pan into the fire??



yes - at least for any other BT-based breadband access in the UK


To clarify, not LLU ISPs that don't use BTs network for data transfer.
For example, bulldog.
(though their coverage is very, very limited).

Even these ISPs will still have to pay something for network bandwidth,
but probably not as much as BT. (85p/GB)
  #7  
Old February 17th 05, 02:14 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Markus G. Klötzer
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 35
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

Andrew Norman wrote:

I'm playing the cyncic here, but I am going to assume that a lot of
people take advantage of the 1am-8am "download what you like it wont
go toward your usage" thing. I wonder what the result of that will
be...


I had been wondering that too. I expect my usage to go up, I'll be
paying a couple of extra quid most months though as well.
--


I guess that is why they said 1am. You must be hardcore without a
dayjob to fill your pipe at 1am regulary without clocking up bw before
and after.

So I'd say we will be a while of that being a problem

cu

mgk
--
"Your present circumstances don't determine where you can go;
they merely determine where you start." -- Nido Qubein
  #8  
Old February 17th 05, 02:39 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Richard Sobey
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 234
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:46:49 +0000, Andrew Norman
wrote:

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:31:18 +0000, Richard Sobey
wrote:

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 13:22:17 +0000, Andrew Norman
wrote:

I am currently on Lite and the fact that uploads and over night
downloads come off my total has always annoyed me. When the new regime
comes I will be moving to the lowest cost Premier option.


I'm playing the cyncic here, but I am going to assume that a lot of
people take advantage of the 1am-8am "download what you like it wont
go toward your usage" thing. I wonder what the result of that will
be...


I had been wondering that too. I expect my usage to go up, I'll be
paying a couple of extra quid most months though as well.


I was trying to point out that if a lot of people do this, you may hit
contention since this may effectively turn into a peak period for
Plusnet's heavier users. Therefore you may not be able to download
very much!
  #9  
Old February 17th 05, 02:44 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andrew Norman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 96
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???

On Thu, 17 Feb 2005 14:14:58 +0000, "Markus G. Klötzer"
wrote:

Andrew Norman wrote:

I'm playing the cyncic here, but I am going to assume that a lot of
people take advantage of the 1am-8am "download what you like it wont
go toward your usage" thing. I wonder what the result of that will
be...


I had been wondering that too. I expect my usage to go up, I'll be
paying a couple of extra quid most months though as well.
--


I guess that is why they said 1am. You must be hardcore without a
dayjob to fill your pipe at 1am regulary without clocking up bw before
and after.

So I'd say we will be a while of that being a problem


Except that at least one of the p2p apps has a handy plugin that lets
you choose how much bandwidth it uses at different times of the day...

I already use this to queue up things (Linux and MSDN ISOs mainly) for
download overnight on my non-Plusnet 512k line that doesn't count
overnight downloads.
--
Andy Norman
http://www.norman.cx/
Replace the fish with my first name to reply
  #10  
Old February 17th 05, 04:02 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Dave
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,446
Default Plusnet..Will anyone else be better???


"JC" johncalias-newsgroupsATyahooD0TcoD0Tuk wrote in message
...
Hi all,

Let me straight off the bat state that I am a ****ed off Plusnet

customer.

I have been with them for a year or so no, having migrated from

BTOpenworld
and was *absolutely* sold a monthly contract unlimited service and had

this
confirmed on numerous occasions. By unlimited, I understood this to mean
that I could download as much as I wanted within the physical constraints
of the transport mechanism

I'm not one of the "bad boys" and possibly won't be too affected by their
caps. I do download a bit of bittorrent p2p, mainly TV programmes like

CSI,
Enterprise & Stargate Atlantis...however I do use VOIP from home. I am a
home-based worker and I use a corporate soft-phone. I also have a

wireless
network with another 3 PCs attached, though traffic usage on these is

very
low.

I can *kind of* see why they are introducing caps..it is the way they

have
gone about it, that has really ****ed me off. It is almost as if they

made
a determined effort to antagonise their customers.

They embarked on a "fixed" survey
Published the results and made them look as if the users had approved of
them
They then completely ignored these results and introduced caps, roughly
half of the limits in the survey.

Then in a blatantly dishonest manner, they have tried to use a real cloak
and mirror act to state that these caps are in no way a change of

existing
T&Cs, merely a clarification..though there is no mention at all, of any
sort of Fair Usage in the T&Cs for them to clarify.....besides T&Cs..to

the
best of my knowledge can not be legally "clarified" or embelished..the
appropriate level of detail should be there to begin with.

So, do I take my custom elsewhere or just accept that I am paying my

money
to a dishonest company?

Well, I had a long chat with Zen this morning and the guy trotted out the
company line that "We have no plans for any bandwidth cap at the moment"
and indeed, the website clearly states "no bandwidth cap"

However, during the course of this conversation, I asked what would

likely
happen if, together with the advent of MaxDSL, Zen found themselves
inheriting masses of users, expecting to be able to download 500Gb of

files
every month..and he admitted that if this were to happen, Zen would

likely
be reluctantly forced to take actions to ensure the viability of the
service for the majority of their users.

And therein lies the problem...If I migrate from PN, will I be jumping

out
of the frying pan into the fire??

I am frankly disgusted with PN's actions throughout this whole debacle,

but
as the "I'm alright Jack" faction have been professing, it's my money and

I
use it where it is most effective *for me*.

Does that mean that I will ever trust PN again...unlikely.
Does it mean that I will tell people what I think of my ISP if
asked...absolutely
Would I recommend PN as a reputable ISP...NO!!
Will I be migrating away on a point of principle?.....Only if whatever

deal
I find is better *for me*

YMMV


There are plenty to choose from outthere, so get shot of PN, have a look
here......
http://www.xifos.net/index.php?page=adsl_overview
(they know what the likes of PN have done and dont do it thereselves)
you could even go here...
http://www.solo.pipex.net/xtreme-solutions/
(they have had a choice of capped or non capped for ages, and it dont look
like changing, and i imagine they have as many if not more customers as PN)
http://www.broadsurf.co.uk/
(they claim Unlimited usage and time on all their packages)
there are soooooo many more out their, so get shot of PN and there
dis-honesty



 




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