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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

ADSL Max confusion



 
 
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  #1  
Old April 12th 06, 04:38 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Simon
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 19
Default ADSL Max confusion

Hi,
I'm bit confused about ADSL Max. I was aware of LLU and had resigned
myself to the fact that my little rural exchange would be last in the
line for this service. I've now found out that the exchange has been
enabled for ADSL Max. I thought the whole point of LLU was to enable 8
meg connections. Now ADSL Max is available, what is the benefit of LLU?

The service I get from my ISP (Garner Digital) has always provided for
a free upgrade to 8Mbps (or as fast as possible), but I'd always
assumed that this refered to LLU. Now my exchange has ADSL Max, how
simple is it to upgrade? There's no mention of ADSL Max on the ISP
website and I'm still waiting for a reply from them.

  #2  
Old April 12th 06, 04:51 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Peter Crosland
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Posts: 1,463
Default ADSL Max confusion

Just ask your ISP to get it done. They have to order it from BT and it costs
them a fiver maximum.

--
Peter Crosland


  #3  
Old April 12th 06, 04:51 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
poster
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,542
Default ADSL Max confusion

On 12 Apr 2006 "Simon" wrote:

I'm bit confused about ADSL Max. I was aware of LLU and had resigned
myself to the fact that my little rural exchange would be last in the
line for this service. I've now found out that the exchange has been
enabled for ADSL Max. I thought the whole point of LLU was to enable 8
meg connections. Now ADSL Max is available, what is the benefit of LLU?


LLU allows alternative firms ( Bulldog, Easynet/UK Online, Be, Tiscali,
and probably some more, check on www.samknows.com ) to provide your line
with a data connection onto their ADSL kit, which means that if LLU was
in place, then people who had switched might have had access to higher
speeds for much longer (a friend of mine has had Bulldog for a couple
of years I think... last spring/summer he switched to 8000 - though
he's getting about 7200 kbps) whereas users of other ISPs, on BTW
products (IPstream/DataStream), have been limited to 2000 kbps.

The service I get from my ISP (Garner Digital) has always provided for
a free upgrade to 8Mbps (or as fast as possible), but I'd always
assumed that this refered to LLU. Now my exchange has ADSL Max, how
simple is it to upgrade? There's no mention of ADSL Max on the ISP
website and I'm still waiting for a reply from them.


They (along with other ISPs) have to place orders to regrade your line
from whatever speed it is now to the new IPStream Max product. With a
few million lines (from the biggest ISPs down to the smallest) it will
take a number of months to do everyone. You'll probably find yours is
earlier than some ISPs with 100,000 customers, as inevitably there has
to be someone at the "end of the queue" for each of those bigger ISPs.
  #4  
Old April 12th 06, 04:58 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
poster
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,542
Default ADSL Max confusion

On 12 Apr 2006, I wrote:

LLU allows alternative firms ... to provide your line with a data
connection onto their ADSL kit,


Forgot to add - that takes it away from the BT Centrals onto their own
networks (perhaps via fibre rented from BT, depends on the area anyway)
and because it goes via their own networks, prices for shifting data is
no longer fixed by BT, so the ISP can offer higher levels of traffic if
they want, and/or lower prices. EG UK Online has a fee of 9.99 for the
lowest speed connection, and while you can find several ISPs with their
own services priced from 11 to 15 quid, they offer small quota of data,
as BT cost is around 8 quid (plus VAT, I think) and then data is on top
of that, so the ISPs cannot afford to offer 50 GB for 15 quid, usually,
if they are making use of BT for the link from your exchange... LLU can
really come into its own, there. Also see www.adslguide.org Peter.
  #5  
Old April 12th 06, 05:00 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Malcolm Knight
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Posts: 16
Default ADSL Max confusion

"Simon" wrote in message
ups.com...
Hi,
I'm bit confused about ADSL Max. I was aware of LLU and had resigned
myself to the fact that my little rural exchange would be last in the
line for this service. I've now found out that the exchange has been
enabled for ADSL Max. I thought the whole point of LLU was to enable 8
meg connections. Now ADSL Max is available, what is the benefit of LLU?


If the LLU is vanilla ADSL and the only issue is speed, then probably
nothing.

The service I get from my ISP (Garner Digital) has always provided for
a free upgrade to 8Mbps (or as fast as possible), but I'd always
assumed that this refered to LLU. Now my exchange has ADSL Max, how
simple is it to upgrade? There's no mention of ADSL Max on the ISP


Not even this? http://www.garnerdigital.com/broadband/home.html

website and I'm still waiting for a reply from them.


I am on a similar small ISP and my regrade to MaxDSL went through seamlessly
exactly a week ago. Not that the speed gets anywhere near peak other than
in the very early morning.
--
Malcolm


  #6  
Old April 12th 06, 05:21 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
PlusNet Support Team
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 995
Default ADSL Max confusion

Peter Crosland wrote:
Just ask your ISP to get it done. They have to order it from BT and it costs
them a fiver maximum.


AIUI, that depends on what sort of order it is Peter. A modify order
(which can be completed in a day) costs more than a regrade (normally
takes a few days - a week). BT will not have a bulk regrade tool until
later this month and are restictive regarding the number of modify
orders they will accept from ISPs at the moment.

Regards,

--
|Bob Pullen Broadband Solutions for
|Training & Project Liaison Home & Business @
|PlusNet plc www.plus.net
+ ----- PlusNet - The smarter way to broadband ------
  #7  
Old April 12th 06, 06:05 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andrew Norman
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Posts: 14
Default ADSL Max confusion

On Wed, 12 Apr 2006 17:00:57 +0100, "Malcolm Knight"
wrote:

Not even this? http://www.garnerdigital.com/broadband/home.html


It doesn't look likely that they are using Max yet, as my exchange
isn't unbundled, but is Max'd and their line checker shows a max speed
of 2Mb for my line (which is currently running at 7Mb on Max).
--
Andy Norman
http://www.gigajam.com/
Learn to Play Guitar, Bass, Keyboard and Drums.
Itís easy with our Lessons and Software!
  #8  
Old April 12th 06, 07:21 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Peter Crosland
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,463
Default ADSL Max confusion

Just ask your ISP to get it done. They have to order it from BT and it
costs them a fiver maximum.


AIUI, that depends on what sort of order it is Peter. A modify order
(which can be completed in a day) costs more than a regrade (normally
takes a few days - a week). BT will not have a bulk regrade tool until
later this month and are restictive regarding the number of modify orders
they will accept from ISPs at the moment.



Fair comment Bob but how does a regrade differ from modify? Is this BT speak
for we can charge more?

Peter Crosland


  #9  
Old April 12th 06, 11:50 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
emmaitch
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default ADSL Max confusion

Hi Alan,

"Alan LeHun" wrote in message
...
In article . com,
says...
Hi,
I'm bit confused about ADSL Max. I was aware of LLU and had resigned
myself to the fact that my little rural exchange would be last in the
line for this service. I've now found out that the exchange has been
enabled for ADSL Max. I thought the whole point of LLU was to enable
8
meg connections. Now ADSL Max is available, what is the benefit of
LLU?


This bit I have no problems with

No. The advantage of LLU is that it (pretty much) removes BT from the
equation, by allowing other operators to install their equipment in BT
exchanges


but this bit

and take over the running of the local wire to your house.

requires, I believe, that you emulate Fagin, in "Oliver" i.e. "I think
I'd better think it out again".

You seem to be suggesting that each LLU operator has operatives who are
going to go into BT line boxes to sort out problems with the local wire
to a subscriber's house. If they found a problem with the existing line
pair how would they resolve it? They don't 'own', or necessarily 'run'
any other wires in the line box. Are you suggesting a free-for-all where
they just nick a pair that doesn't seem to be active at the time of
their looking?

I would suggest that this is why Openreach was set up; to preserve the
integrity of the network. The LLU operator leases the lines from
Openreach and it is Openreach who maintain those lines.

regards,

Mike Hardy

  #10  
Old April 13th 06, 07:24 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Peter Crosland
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,463
Default ADSL Max confusion

and take over the running of the local wire to your house.

[]
I would suggest that this is why Openreach was set up; to preserve the
integrity of the network. The LLU operator leases the lines from
Openreach and it is Openreach who maintain those lines.

Yes. I was writing from a consumer's pov who, were they to have a
problem with their line, would approach their operator. Openreach is
invisible to the end user.


Exactly. Thats why you cannot communicate with them!

Peter Crosland


 




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