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uk.comp.home-networking (UK home networking) (uk.comp.home-networking) Discussion of all aspects of computer networking in the home, regardless of the platforms, software, topologies and protocols used. Examples of topics include recommendations for hardware or suppliers (e.g. NICs and cabling), protocols, servers, and specific network software. Advertising is not allowed.

cable router behind ADSL router



 
 
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  #1  
Old December 15th 08, 10:47 AM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
Ric
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 29
Default cable router behind ADSL router

Hi All,
This might be a tad OT in two of these groups, but you're all
knowledgeable people so hope it doesn't irritate anyone too much.

quick sanity check:

I've got a Sky-supplied Netgear D834GT router, and I want to use that
solely as an ADSL modem, and plug it into my new D-Link DIR-655 draft-
N gigabit cable router so I get gigabit speeds on wired, and draft-N
wirelessly.

Being Sky-supplied, the Netgear uses Sky's firmware which lacks the
native half-bridge support I was planning to use. Being Sky, they
hide the ADSL username and password, too. I *think* I've found this
out, so I could flash it back to Netgear's standard firmware which
offers half-bridging, but if I'm wrong, I'm going to lose my internet
access for a while, so...

I was originally going to connect a LAN port on the Netgear to the WAN
port on the D-Link, put the public IP of the Dlink in the Netgear's
DMZ and use it that way. However, it occurred to me that there might
be an easier way avoiding potential double-NAT issues.

Can anyone see any flaws in turning off the Netgear wifi, and plugging
a DLink LAN port (i.e. not using the WAN connection at all on the
Dlink) into the Netgear LAN port. I then get all clients to connect
wirelessly at draft-N speeds to the Dlink, and any traffic moving
around the LAN will presumably be handled by the switch built into the
Dlink, i.e. at gigabit speeds when cabled. DHCP could come from
either box, I figure it wouldn't matter. The Netgear would still
handle firewall duties, and the QoS built into the Dlink would still
work as it'd be regulating traffic connected directly to it. In
effect the Dlink would be acting as a wireless switch rather than
routing, I guess.

Am I missing something that'd stop this working?

A neater solution might be to buy a cheapo ADSL modem with ethernet
out that works in bridge mode, if anyone can suggest a likely
candidate?

Cheers
Ric
  #2  
Old December 15th 08, 12:31 PM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
Conor
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 161
Default cable router behind ADSL router

In article 3bdff542-cf2d-4a66-806a-
, Ric says...
Hi All,
This might be a tad OT in two of these groups, but you're all
knowledgeable people so hope it doesn't irritate anyone too much.

quick sanity check:

I've got a Sky-supplied Netgear D834GT router, and I want to use that
solely as an ADSL modem, and plug it into my new D-Link DIR-655 draft-
N gigabit cable router so I get gigabit speeds on wired, and draft-N
wirelessly.

Being Sky-supplied, the Netgear uses Sky's firmware which lacks the
native half-bridge support I was planning to use. Being Sky, they
hide the ADSL username and password, too. I *think* I've found this
out, so I could flash it back to Netgear's standard firmware which
offers half-bridging, but if I'm wrong, I'm going to lose my internet
access for a while, so...

I was originally going to connect a LAN port on the Netgear to the WAN
port on the D-Link, put the public IP of the Dlink in the Netgear's
DMZ and use it that way. However, it occurred to me that there might
be an easier way avoiding potential double-NAT issues.

Can anyone see any flaws in turning off the Netgear wifi, and plugging
a DLink LAN port (i.e. not using the WAN connection at all on the
Dlink) into the Netgear LAN port. I then get all clients to connect
wirelessly at draft-N speeds to the Dlink, and any traffic moving
around the LAN will presumably be handled by the switch built into the
Dlink, i.e. at gigabit speeds when cabled. DHCP could come from
either box, I figure it wouldn't matter. The Netgear would still
handle firewall duties, and the QoS built into the Dlink would still
work as it'd be regulating traffic connected directly to it. In
effect the Dlink would be acting as a wireless switch rather than
routing, I guess.

Am I missing something that'd stop this working?

Just make sure that only one device has DHCP running.


--
Conor

I only please one person per day. Today is not your day. Tomorrow isn't
looking good either. - Scott Adams
  #3  
Old December 15th 08, 07:08 PM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
Clint Sharp
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 550
Default cable router behind ADSL router

In message , Conor
writes
Am I missing something that'd stop this working?

Just make sure that only one device has DHCP running.

Would you even need to do this? If the second router is a cable router
for an Ethernet presented service then I think it may just think the WAN
IP is the one assigned to it from the Sky router's DHCP as the cable
router is highly unlikely to do DHCP pass through. I could be very wrong
here but I've certainly used an old Belkin cable router this way. The
only immediate problem I can think of is if the private IP scope is the
same for both devices, then the NAT/routing tables might get a tad
upset...



--
Clint Sharp
  #4  
Old December 16th 08, 01:04 AM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
John Jordan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 14
Default cable router behind ADSL router

Ric wrote:

Can anyone see any flaws in turning off the Netgear wifi, and plugging
a DLink LAN port (i.e. not using the WAN connection at all on the
Dlink) into the Netgear LAN port. I then get all clients to connect
wirelessly at draft-N speeds to the Dlink, and any traffic moving
around the LAN will presumably be handled by the switch built into the
Dlink, i.e. at gigabit speeds when cabled. DHCP could come from
either box, I figure it wouldn't matter. The Netgear would still
handle firewall duties, and the QoS built into the Dlink would still
work as it'd be regulating traffic connected directly to it. In
effect the Dlink would be acting as a wireless switch rather than
routing, I guess.


QoS usually works at TCP rather than ethernet level, so the Dlink's QoS
wouldn't be active. Also what Conor said about only having one DHCP
server. Usually you have to use the DHCP server on the router, because
they don't let you configure the gateway address.

Other than that it works fine and is usually a much better option than
bouncing everything through two layers of router bugs.


--
John Jordan
  #5  
Old December 17th 08, 02:16 PM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
Marge
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 32
Default cable router behind ADSL router

On Dec 15, 10:47*am, Ric wrote:
Hi All,
This might be a tad OT in two of these groups, but you're all
knowledgeable people so hope it doesn't irritate anyone too much.

quick sanity check:

I've got a Sky-supplied Netgear D834GT router, and I want to use that
solely as an ADSL modem, and plug it into my new D-Link DIR-655 draft-
N gigabit cable router so I get gigabit speeds on wired, and draft-N
wirelessly.

Being Sky-supplied, the Netgear uses Sky's firmware which lacks the
native half-bridge support I was planning to use. *Being Sky, they
hide the ADSL username and password, too. *I *think* I've found this
out, so I could flash it back to Netgear's standard firmware which
offers half-bridging, but if I'm wrong, I'm going to lose my internet
access for a while, so...

I was originally going to connect a LAN port on the Netgear to the WAN
port on the D-Link, put the public IP of the Dlink in the Netgear's
DMZ and use it that way. *However, it occurred to me that there might
be an easier way avoiding potential double-NAT issues.

Can anyone see any flaws in turning off the Netgear wifi, and plugging
a DLink LAN port (i.e. not using the WAN connection at all on the
Dlink) into the Netgear LAN port. *I then get all clients to connect
wirelessly at draft-N speeds to the Dlink, and any traffic moving
around the LAN will presumably be handled by the switch built into the
Dlink, i.e. at gigabit speeds when cabled. *DHCP could come from
either box, I figure it wouldn't matter. *The Netgear would still
handle firewall duties, and the QoS built into the Dlink would still
work as it'd be regulating traffic connected directly to it. *In
effect the Dlink would be acting as a wireless switch rather than
routing, I guess.

Am I missing something that'd stop this working?

A neater solution might be to buy a cheapo ADSL modem with ethernet
out that works in bridge mode, if anyone can suggest a likely
candidate?

Cheers
Ric


Theres no problem with flashing the latest NetGear firmware, I did
mine 12 months ago,
http://kbserver.netgear.com/products/DG834GT.asp

this sites pretty good too, sorry if you've already visited both
http://www.skyuser.co.uk/forum/techn...-password.html



  #6  
Old December 17th 08, 11:59 PM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
Ric
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 29
Default cable router behind ADSL router

On 16 Dec, 01:04, John Jordan wrote:
Ric wrote:

Can anyone see any flaws in turning off the Netgear wifi, and plugging
a DLink LAN port (i.e. not using the WAN connection at all on the
Dlink) into the Netgear LAN port. I then get all clients to connect
wirelessly at draft-N speeds to the Dlink, and any traffic moving
around the LAN will presumably be handled by the switch built into the
Dlink, i.e. at gigabit speeds when cabled. DHCP could come from
either box, I figure it wouldn't matter. The Netgear would still
handle firewall duties, and the QoS built into the Dlink would still
work as it'd be regulating traffic connected directly to it. In
effect the Dlink would be acting as a wireless switch rather than
routing, I guess.


QoS usually works at TCP rather than ethernet level, so the Dlink's QoS
wouldn't be active. Also what Conor said about only having one DHCP
server. Usually you have to use the DHCP server on the router, because
they don't let you configure the gateway address.

Other than that it works fine and is usually a much better option than
bouncing everything through two layers of router bugs.

--
John Jordan


it's working, and so is DHCP from netgear to clients on Dlink - but
can you elaborate on the QoS? that *isn't* working, and i'd quite
like it to. any pointers? do i need a bridging adsl ethernet modem
instead of the netgear?
  #7  
Old December 18th 08, 01:04 AM posted to uk.comp.sys.mac,uk.comp.home-networking,uk.comp.homebuilt
John Jordan
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 14
Default cable router behind ADSL router

Ric wrote:

it's working, and so is DHCP from netgear to clients on Dlink - but
can you elaborate on the QoS? that *isn't* working, and i'd quite
like it to. any pointers?


The Dlink most likely applies QoS on traffic routed between WAN and LAN,
because it's managing TCP endpoints there anyway. Traffic from LAN to
LAN will simply be forwarded blind.

Apparently there's also a type of QoS for wireless APs, but I suspect
that's pretty rare. It wouldn't necessarily be useful either.

do i need a bridging adsl ethernet modem
instead of the netgear?


That would be the ideal solution.


--
John Jordan
 




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