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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

Devious goings on?



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 8th 12, 03:40 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
PeterL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7
Default Devious goings on?

A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up, our
otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the provider told
us, was the result of line re-training. They say the speed should go back
up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?


  #2  
Old October 8th 12, 04:51 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 620
Default Devious goings on?

PeterL wrote:
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up, our
otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the provider
told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the speed should
go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?


Presumably the current provider is not Plusnet ...

What SNR margin and loop loss figures were shown in the router before
you lost the connection?

.... and after the connection was restored?

In my experience training starts from the highest possible speed and
reduces to minimse the number of dropouts - so I think what you have
been told is BS

--
Graham J

  #3  
Old October 8th 12, 04:56 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
David
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 498
Default Devious goings on?



"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up, our
otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the provider
told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the speed should go
back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher than
these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David

  #4  
Old October 8th 12, 05:41 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 620
Default Devious goings on?

David wrote:


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David



No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

--
Graham J

  #5  
Old October 8th 12, 06:22 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
PeterL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7
Default Devious goings on?

"Graham J" wrote in message
...

David wrote:


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David



No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The switchover to fibre is still two weeks away; we don't even have the
router yet. Plusnets download speed estimate is 33Mb.

Yes, shortly after signing up on line, the connection became very unstable
and it's been unstable since! It probably is just coincidence. I don't
have 'prior to' stats but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up
Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues are
probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master socket.




  #6  
Old October 8th 12, 07:30 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Peter Able
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 114
Default Devious goings on?


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
"Graham J" wrote in message
...

David wrote:


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David



No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The switchover to fibre is still two weeks away; we don't even have the
router yet. Plusnets download speed estimate is 33Mb.

Yes, shortly after signing up on line, the connection became very unstable
and it's been unstable since! It probably is just coincidence. I don't
have 'prior to' stats but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up
Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues are
probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master
socket.


I doubt that you'd ever achieve "rock-solid 2Mb download speed " on
a -66.5dB line, so something's up.

PA


  #7  
Old October 8th 12, 08:26 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
The Natural Philosopher
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,728
Default Devious goings on?

Peter Able wrote:
"PeterL" wrote in message
...
"Graham J" wrote in message
...

David wrote:

"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?


Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David


No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The switchover to fibre is still two weeks away; we don't even have the
router yet. Plusnets download speed estimate is 33Mb.

Yes, shortly after signing up on line, the connection became very unstable
and it's been unstable since! It probably is just coincidence. I don't
have 'prior to' stats but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s Up
Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues are
probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master
socket.


I doubt that you'd ever achieve "rock-solid 2Mb download speed " on
a -66.5dB line, so something's up.

PA


Bad joint id say

--
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc'-ra-cy) - a system of government where the least capable to
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a
diminishing number of producers.
  #8  
Old October 8th 12, 09:57 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 620
Default Devious goings on?

[snip]


Yes, shortly after signing up on line,


BE SPECIFIC - a minute, an hour, a day ??????

the connection became very
unstable and it's been unstable since! It probably is just
coincidence. I don't have 'prior to' stats


But you should! Keep a snapshot of performance at monthly intervals,
more frequently if its variable.


but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s
Up Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues
are probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master
socket.


It is easy for you to prove them wrong!

The upstream speed of 604 kbits/sec suggests the exchange hardware is
configured for ADSL2+. Reconfiguring it to ADSL1 will reduce the
upstream speed to 448k but may allow the downstream speed to increase
significantly - to about 2Mbits/sec.

A good ISP (e.g Andrews & Arnold)) will give you a control panel where
you can adjust this. Others won't even know what you're talking about.

--
Graham J




  #9  
Old October 9th 12, 09:14 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
PeeGee
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 311
Default Devious goings on?

On 08/10/12 18:22, PeterL wrote:
"Graham J" wrote in message
...

David wrote:


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David



No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


The switchover to fibre is still two weeks away; we don't even have the
router yet. Plusnets download speed estimate is 33Mb.

Yes, shortly after signing up on line, the connection became very
unstable and it's been unstable since! It probably is just
coincidence. I don't have 'prior to' stats but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s
Up Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues
are probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master
socket.




Have you put a question on the Plusnet "broadband" forum?

It may be that a precursor to FTTC is moving to 21CN if you are on 20CN,
which (I think) does not allow ADSL1 connections (certainly, my router
set to ADSL1 does not sync). Though the time scale you give is very
short for a change.

My line has attenuation figures 5dB lower than yours and *can* hold
4Mbps/650kbps but, after yesterdays rain, is 1.8Mbps/619kbps.

Plusnet always want you to try and eliminate internal wiring to avoid
any BT/OR charge for no fault on "their" wiring, though the suggestion
is a bit "strong". A few weeks ago, with my line testing as "balanced"
from the exchange, an OR engineer eventually came, tested the line and
replaced a defective NTE5 - though it appears there is another problem
now (with rain!).

Do you connect/have you tried connecting directly to the test socket?
That's the first thing on Plusnet's fault reporting check-list.

What does a "quiet line test" indicate?

--
PeeGee

"Nothing should be able to load itself onto a computer without the
knowledge or consent of the computer user. Software should also be able
to be removed from a computer easily."
Peter Cullen, Microsoft Chief Privacy Strategist (Computing 18 Aug 05)
  #10  
Old October 9th 12, 10:41 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
PeterL
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7
Default Devious goings on?



"PeeGee" wrote in message
o.uk...

On 08/10/12 18:22, PeterL wrote:
"Graham J" wrote in message
...

David wrote:


"PeterL" wrote in message
...
A few days ago we decided to sign up for fibre broadband with Plusnet.
Almost straightaway, we lost our connection. When it came back up,
our otherwise rock-solid 2Mb download speed became 1Mb, which the
provider told us, was the result of line re-training. They say the
speed should go back up over the course of the next 9 days.

Pure coincidence?!?



Are you saying Fiber is slower than copper?
What estimate of Fiber did Plusnet give you? Surely it was not higher
than these speeds you quote or you would not have changed.
Regards
David



No, I think what he said is that the process of signing up for Fibre
caused his existing copper connection speed to be halved. But that
might not be what he actually meant ...

I suppose it is theoretically possible that Plusnet interrogated his
line as part of the sign-up process; and this interrogation caused the
line speed to drop. But without supporting evidence of before/after
figures from the router ...

For how long was the connection down? Seconds? Minutes? Hours? How
long after signing up with Plusnet did the line drop - Seconds? Minutes?

I suppose it is also possible that as part of the sign-up process
Plusnet commissioned Openreach to carry out some work on the line in the
exchange - which might have moved the connection to different equipment
with poorer performance.

To the OP - when do you expect to get the Fibre connection?

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


The switchover to fibre is still two weeks away; we don't even have the
router yet. Plusnets download speed estimate is 33Mb.

Yes, shortly after signing up on line, the connection became very
unstable and it's been unstable since! It probably is just
coincidence. I don't have 'prior to' stats but these are the current:

Port Status TxPkts RxPkts Collisions Tx B/s Rx B/s
Up Time
WAN MER 112 10306 0 793200 5321967 0:05:45
LAN Up 14401 18012 0 6376511 4511149 2:02:01
WLAN Up 3886 5350 0 1319383 575697 2:01:42

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 500 kbps 604 kbps
Line Attenuation 66.5 dB 42.4 dB
Noise Margin 5.7 dB 7.4 dB

In talking to the ISP, they say the line is clear and that the issues
are probably associated with faulty equipment our side of the BT master
socket.




Have you put a question on the Plusnet "broadband" forum?

It may be that a precursor to FTTC is moving to 21CN if you are on 20CN,
which (I think) does not allow ADSL1 connections (certainly, my router
set to ADSL1 does not sync). Though the time scale you give is very
short for a change.

My line has attenuation figures 5dB lower than yours and *can* hold
4Mbps/650kbps but, after yesterdays rain, is 1.8Mbps/619kbps.

Plusnet always want you to try and eliminate internal wiring to avoid
any BT/OR charge for no fault on "their" wiring, though the suggestion
is a bit "strong". A few weeks ago, with my line testing as "balanced"
from the exchange, an OR engineer eventually came, tested the line and
replaced a defective NTE5 - though it appears there is another problem
now (with rain!).

Do you connect/have you tried connecting directly to the test socket?
That's the first thing on Plusnet's fault reporting check-list.

What does a "quiet line test" indicate?

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

We've been connected to the test socket since Saturday. Otherwise we use a
filtered faceplate.

This morning, I finally got through to Level 2 technical support with my
current ISP and after some line testing, they've decided to send out a BT OR
engineer. I think he said SFF? I did volunteer that we were on the verge
of moving to fibre with another provider but on the basis they weren't
providing a satisfactory service at the present time, they would continue
with the BT OR appointment.

Line stats have now 'improved' to:

ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
Connection Speed 1296 kbps 252 kbps
Line Attenuation 65.5 dB 42.1 dB
Noise Margin 11.2 dB 15.9 dB

For the moment, at least, the connection seems to be stable.

 




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