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uk.comp.home-networking (UK home networking) (uk.comp.home-networking) Discussion of all aspects of computer networking in the home, regardless of the platforms, software, topologies and protocols used. Examples of topics include recommendations for hardware or suppliers (e.g. NICs and cabling), protocols, servers, and specific network software. Advertising is not allowed.

dyndns changes



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 30th 13, 04:50 PM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Mike Scott
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24
Default dyndns changes

I seem to have come unstuck in using dyndns. For some years, I've been
using their free service to provide a target for my domain's MX record.
They used to require the address to be updated monthly (or thereabouts)
to keep it live; all worked well. Now they've changed the rules, and
require that one log into the accounts area monthly instead. Tedious,
and if I'm away when the 5-day warning appears, that would be just too bad.

I have now registered with no-ip, who don't (yet) seem to have gone this
route. Unfortunately, it seems my netgear router won't handle no-ip - it
offers a choice of dyndns, and take it or leave it.

I could run a no-ip client on the freebsd server I keep running 24/7,
but as that's only on my LAN, it doesn't know my WAN address, and I
can't see a reliable way for it to obtain this.

The netgear dg384g doesn't seem to have a way to act as modem only
(which is all I really need; the fbsd box acts as router and firewall).

Short of buying a modem or paying dyndns significant dosh (I'd not mind
a token amount), I seem stuck.

Any thoughts please?


--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England
  #2  
Old June 30th 13, 06:02 PM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
GlowingBlueMist
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default dyndns changes

On 6/30/2013 10:50 AM, Mike Scott wrote:
I seem to have come unstuck in using dyndns. For some years, I've been
using their free service to provide a target for my domain's MX record.
They used to require the address to be updated monthly (or thereabouts)
to keep it live; all worked well. Now they've changed the rules, and
require that one log into the accounts area monthly instead. Tedious,
and if I'm away when the 5-day warning appears, that would be just too bad.

I have now registered with no-ip, who don't (yet) seem to have gone this
route. Unfortunately, it seems my netgear router won't handle no-ip - it
offers a choice of dyndns, and take it or leave it.

I could run a no-ip client on the freebsd server I keep running 24/7,
but as that's only on my LAN, it doesn't know my WAN address, and I
can't see a reliable way for it to obtain this.

The netgear dg384g doesn't seem to have a way to act as modem only
(which is all I really need; the fbsd box acts as router and firewall).

Short of buying a modem or paying dyndns significant dosh (I'd not mind
a token amount), I seem stuck.

Any thoughts please?


I'd go ahead and plug in the no-ip client on your server.

If memory serves correctly the client at your end combined with the
software at the no-ip end are able to determine the WAN IP address even
if your server is behind a router thus making the ability to update the
no-ip DNS servers possible with your current WAN IP.

Other than the above I'd look into a cheap router that is on the dd-wrt
approved list and upgrade it to use their firmware which should have
more options than just dyndns.

The approved list can be found at;
http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Supported_Devices

Many times Linksys or other supposedly outdated routers can be had for
next to nothing especially if you check the recycling shops or charities
which accept electronics. If it is on the approved list you should be
able to upgrade it to use dd-wrt which usually comes with a broader
range of options.

  #3  
Old June 30th 13, 06:02 PM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Bernard Peek
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 202
Default dyndns changes

On 30/06/13 16:50, Mike Scott wrote:
I seem to have come unstuck in using dyndns. For some years, I've been
using their free service to provide a target for my domain's MX record.
They used to require the address to be updated monthly (or thereabouts)
to keep it live; all worked well. Now they've changed the rules, and
require that one log into the accounts area monthly instead. Tedious,
and if I'm away when the 5-day warning appears, that would be just too bad.

I have now registered with no-ip, who don't (yet) seem to have gone this
route. Unfortunately, it seems my netgear router won't handle no-ip - it
offers a choice of dyndns, and take it or leave it.

I could run a no-ip client on the freebsd server I keep running 24/7,
but as that's only on my LAN, it doesn't know my WAN address, and I
can't see a reliable way for it to obtain this.


When the client contacts no-ip the request will be NATed by your router.
This involves stripping out the private IP address and substituting its
own external address. This and the name of your domain is all that no-ip
needs to know,



--
Bernard Peek

  #4  
Old June 30th 13, 08:00 PM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Mike Scott
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24
Default dyndns changes

On 30/06/13 18:02, GlowingBlueMist wrote:
On 6/30/2013 10:50 AM, Mike Scott wrote:
I seem to have come unstuck in using dyndns. For some years, I've been
using their free service to provide a target for my domain's MX record.
They used to require the address to be updated monthly (or thereabouts)
to keep it live; all worked well. Now they've changed the rules, and
require that one log into the accounts area monthly instead. Tedious,
and if I'm away when the 5-day warning appears, that would be just too
bad.

I have now registered with no-ip, who don't (yet) seem to have gone this
route. Unfortunately, it seems my netgear router won't handle no-ip - it
offers a choice of dyndns, and take it or leave it.

I could run a no-ip client on the freebsd server I keep running 24/7,
but as that's only on my LAN, it doesn't know my WAN address, and I
can't see a reliable way for it to obtain this.

The netgear dg384g doesn't seem to have a way to act as modem only
(which is all I really need; the fbsd box acts as router and firewall).

Short of buying a modem or paying dyndns significant dosh (I'd not mind
a token amount), I seem stuck.

Any thoughts please?


I'd go ahead and plug in the no-ip client on your server.

If memory serves correctly the client at your end combined with the
software at the no-ip end are able to determine the WAN IP address even
if your server is behind a router thus making the ability to update the
no-ip DNS servers possible with your current WAN IP.


Yes, thanks (and to B.P.) for pointing out I'd missed this. It does of
course work.

OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes (although maybe I could write something nasty that
inspected icmp packets). I assume that the 'noip2' program can detect
when the host's NIC changes address, and force an update. That doesn't
apply here. I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks, and my
email system (I run sendmail here, now using a dyndns name as the MX for
my domain name) needs the DNS to be pretty well up-to-date, or I'll be
losing emails.



Other than the above I'd look into a cheap router that is on the dd-wrt
approved list and upgrade it to use their firmware which should have
more options than just dyndns.

The approved list can be found at;
http://www.dd-wrt.com/wiki/index.php/Supported_Devices


I'd wondered about this code; it's always seemed a bit fraught though.
But I'll take another look; thanks for the reminder.


Many times Linksys or other supposedly outdated routers can be had for
next to nothing especially if you check the recycling shops or charities
which accept electronics. If it is on the approved list you should be


That's actually where I got the netgear - charity shop. But not
supported by ddwrt.


able to upgrade it to use dd-wrt which usually comes with a broader
range of options.



--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England
  #5  
Old July 1st 13, 10:03 AM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Chris Davies
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 444
Default dyndns changes

Mike Scott wrote:
OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes [...]


I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks [...]


I doubt they'd even notice a regular and frequent DNS lookup amongst
the rest of the traffic they're handling. One packet a minute...? JDI.

Chris
  #6  
Old July 1st 13, 10:52 AM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Mike Scott
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24
Default dyndns changes

On 01/07/13 10:03, Chris Davies wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes [...]


I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks [...]


I doubt they'd even notice a regular and frequent DNS lookup amongst
the rest of the traffic they're handling. One packet a minute...? JDI.

Chris


Mmm. Maybe, maybe not. If I recall, I did upset the dyndns people in the
early days with more or less that - their web software checked the
request rate, and I'd got the client caching turned off in error.

I had thought icmp would offer a usable route trace from a lightweight
probe, but can't see how to make this happen. Certainly traceroute only
gives the router's lan address.

Nasty fallback option is a script to log into the router and ask it for
the wan address, then run noip2 'single shot' as needed. Will work, but
seems a heavyweight solution, but at least the client would be readily
changeable.


--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England
  #7  
Old July 1st 13, 11:33 AM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Tony
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 10
Default dyndns changes

On 2013-07-01, Chris Davies wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes [...]


I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks [...]


I doubt they'd even notice a regular and frequent DNS lookup amongst
the rest of the traffic they're handling. One packet a minute...? JDI.


I use this,

dig +short @resolver1.opendns.com myip.opendns.com

every 2 minutes, and they don't seem to mind.

--
Tony Evans
Saving trees and wasting electrons since 1993
blog - http://perceptionistruth.com/
books - http://www.bookthing.co.uk/
[ anything below this line wasn't written by me ]
  #8  
Old July 1st 13, 01:48 PM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Chris Davies
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 444
Default dyndns changes

Mike Scott wrote:
On 01/07/13 10:03, Chris Davies wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes [...]


I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks [...]


I doubt they'd even notice a regular and frequent DNS lookup amongst
the rest of the traffic they're handling. One packet a minute...? JDI.


Mmm. Maybe, maybe not. If I recall, I did upset the dyndns people in the
early days with more or less that - their web software checked the
request rate, and I'd got the client caching turned off in error.


That would have been for the update client, surely? It's far easier
to check the current IP address via DNS. You can even go via Google's
8.8.8.8 if you want to, as that seems to honour DNS TTLs pretty
accurately.

#!/bin/sh
#
MY_DOMAIN=whatever.example.net
host "$MY_DOMAIN" | awk '/address/ {print $NF; exit}'


Nasty fallback option is a script to log into the router and ask it for
the wan address, then run noip2 'single shot' as needed. Will work, but
seems a heavyweight solution, but at least the client would be readily
changeable.


Oh, I think I see. You want to tell your No-IP updater program that the
IP address has changed? I don't think you need to do that - the update
client offered by No-IP seems already to include this feature. See
http://www.noip.com/downloads.php?page=linux

Chris
  #9  
Old July 2nd 13, 06:24 AM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Nollaig MacKenzie
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5
Default dyndns changes


On 2013.06.30 15:50:21,
the amazing declared:

snip!

I could run a no-ip client on the freebsd server I keep running 24/7,
but as that's only on my LAN, it doesn't know my WAN address, and I
can't see a reliable way for it to obtain this.


This is an easy way to get your WAN IP from Dyn:

#!/bin/sh
IP=$(curl http://checkip.dyndns.com 2/dev/null)
IP=${IP##*Address: }
IP=${IP%%*}
echo $IP

snip!
--
Nollaig MacKenzie
http://www.yorku.ca/nollaig
  #10  
Old July 2nd 13, 09:16 AM posted to uk.comp.home-networking
Mike Scott
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24
Default dyndns changes

On 01/07/13 13:48, Chris Davies wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
On 01/07/13 10:03, Chris Davies wrote:
Mike Scott wrote:
OTOH, there's no ready way for hosts on the LAN to detect when the WAN
address changes [...]

I doubt no-ip would be happy with frequent checks [...]

I doubt they'd even notice a regular and frequent DNS lookup amongst
the rest of the traffic they're handling. One packet a minute...? JDI.


Mmm. Maybe, maybe not. If I recall, I did upset the dyndns people in the
early days with more or less that - their web software checked the
request rate, and I'd got the client caching turned off in error.


That would have been for the update client, surely? It's far easier
to check the current IP address via DNS. You can even go via Google's
8.8.8.8 if you want to, as that seems to honour DNS TTLs pretty
accurately.

#!/bin/sh
#
MY_DOMAIN=whatever.example.net
host "$MY_DOMAIN" | awk '/address/ {print $NF; exit}'


I think we're at cross-purposes here. (My fault, as others are making a
similar comment).

I don't have an issue resolving a dynamic domain name. It's what dns is
for. The problem is that if BT changes my ip address, that won't match
the domain name. AIUI if the client software runs on the machine whose
interface is allocated that number, then the client can be notified by
the kernel when that ip changes, and can then contact the dynamic dns
server to get the name updated only when needed.

In my case, the active client runs on the router and won't talk to
no-ip. My freebsd box's interface is a LAN segment, and the box isn't
aware(*) of changes on the WAN side of the router. One solution is
simply to run a client on the fbsd box every minute - which would upset
the good people at the server end for making unnecessary accesses.



Nasty fallback option is a script to log into the router and ask it for
the wan address, then run noip2 'single shot' as needed. Will work, but
seems a heavyweight solution, but at least the client would be readily
changeable.


(*) I have now cobbled together a perl script that reads the router's
status page once a minute, checks whether the address has changed, and
runs the noip2 client only if necessary. The side effect is I can't log
into the router any more - the script needs to log in to get the info
and there's no logout, just a timeout: accessing from another lan
address fails. Also, it doubles the delay in getting the dns updated -
up to a minute for my code to react, then a minute for the dns ttl to
expire.



Oh, I think I see. You want to tell your No-IP updater program that the
IP address has changed? I don't think you need to do that - the update
client offered by No-IP seems already to include this feature. See
http://www.noip.com/downloads.php?page=linux


That's right - except I can only run the noip2 client on the LAN, so it
cannot tell when the WAN ip changes - which is where the problem lies.



BTW, I've been trying to create a dnsdynamic account too, but the
account creation seems to mess up. Are they still operational? They use
ddclient, which seems able to do its own checks on at least some
routers, which is at least tidier, and must be better tested than my own
code!!


Oh, and does anyone know if tp-link modem/routers are "OK"? They seem
very cheap, and I suspect from the manual's pictures they support no-ip
(but can anyone confirm this please? The doc's aren't explicit.) reviews
seem mixed.


Thanks all.

--
Mike Scott (unet2 at [deletethis] scottsonline.org.uk)
Harlow Essex England
 




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