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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?



 
 
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  #1  
Old June 18th 17, 09:19 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

I have recently moved from an ADSL connection to VDSL/FTTC, on the
ADSL connection I used a Draytek Vigor 2820n router. I run a couple
of services on my home LAN, specifically ssh (so I can connect from
the outside world) and SMTP (for mail delivery).

Thus I need a router that does port forwarding and has a configurable
firewall, I want/need to limit the ssh and SMTP access to a few
specific IP addresses 'out there' to minimise the risks.

The PlusNet supplied Home Hub One simply doesn't have a configurable
firewall so, while it's OK at what it does, it doesn't provide what I
need.

So my first try was a TP-Link TD-W9980, it's "end of life" but none of
the more modern TP-Link routers has a firewall. The TP-Link's
firewall is just about up to what I need but it has amuch more
fundamental flaw. When you enable the firewall WiFi users can't
connect to the LAN! Rather a fundamantal bug.

Second try was a Zyxel VMG-3925-B10B, it looks as if it will be
perfect but again the firewall is totally broken. If you set up port
forwarding it bypasses the firewall completely! I.e. I have port 22
forward to a system on my LAN, whatever rules I set up in the firewall
doesn't affect port 22. I can 'block' connections on port 22 and
incoming connections still work!

Are they all this bad? Or is there a router out there with a fairly
basic firewall that actually works?

Can anyone recommend a VDSL2/FTTC router which has a firewall that
works and doesn't cost an arm and a leg?

--
Chris Green

  #2  
Old June 18th 17, 09:59 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 268
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chris Green wrote:

Can anyone recommend a VDSL2/FTTC router which has a firewall that
works and doesn't cost an arm and a leg?


Stick LEDE on the plusnet hub zero ...



  #3  
Old June 19th 17, 09:42 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
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Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Green wrote:

Can anyone recommend a VDSL2/FTTC router which has a firewall that
works and doesn't cost an arm and a leg?


Stick LEDE on the plusnet hub zero ...

I've been down that route with another router, it's not a good
solution for a number of reasons:-

To put LEDE on the Hub One (I don't have a Hub Zero) you have to
do some quite low level hardware stuff and, while I can probably
manage it, I'm not too keen.

LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't seem to have any sort of regular update
system so once installed you're stuck at the same version for
ever.

Quite often LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't support the proprietary bits,
which are nearly always the bits you actually need, i.e. the ADSL
and VDSL2 latest formats.

--
Chris Green

  #4  
Old June 19th 17, 06:31 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 268
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chris Green wrote:

To put LEDE on the Hub One (I don't have a Hub Zero) you have to
do some quite low level hardware stuff and, while I can probably
manage it, I'm not too keen.


it boils down to cracking (hopefully not literally) the case open and
soldering four temporary wires.

LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't seem to have any sort of regular update
system so once installed you're stuck at the same version for
ever.


I upgraded mine from 17.0.0 to 17.0.2 last night, download a bin file
from the internet, and upload it to the router vie its web interface, it
checks checksum, reboots, job done.

Quite often LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't support the proprietary bits,
which are nearly always the bits you actually need, i.e. the ADSL
and VDSL2 latest formats.


The HH5A is the third router I've used openWRT/LEDE on, and as you say
it is the first where the xDSL interface is supported natively, before
I've had to use dual ethernet router with an xDSL modem in bridge mode.

I think it only supports G.inp in one direction, so if you have a long
line, or electrically noisy neighbours you could have an issue, but for
me it is faster than an billion 8800NL was

Status: UP
Line State: showtime_tc_sync [0x801]
Line Mode: G.993.2 (VDSL2)
Annex: B
Profile: 17a
Data Rate: 79.810 Mb/s / 19.999 Mb/s
Max. Attainable Data Rate (ATTNDR): 79.921 Mb/s / 28.058 Mb/s
Latency: 0.20 ms / 0.0 ms
Line Attenuation (LATN): 11.1 dB / 12.5 dB
Signal Attenuation (SATN): 11.3 dB / 12.6 dB
Noise Margin (SNR): 5.9 dB / 15.2 dB
Aggregate Transmit Power(ACTATP): 0.7 dB / 14.1 dB

It's a super little router.
  #5  
Old June 19th 17, 09:47 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Green wrote:

To put LEDE on the Hub One (I don't have a Hub Zero) you have to
do some quite low level hardware stuff and, while I can probably
manage it, I'm not too keen.


it boils down to cracking (hopefully not literally) the case open and
soldering four temporary wires.

LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't seem to have any sort of regular update
system so once installed you're stuck at the same version for
ever.


I upgraded mine from 17.0.0 to 17.0.2 last night, download a bin file
from the internet, and upload it to the router vie its web interface, it
checks checksum, reboots, job done.

Quite often LEDE/OpenWrt doesn't support the proprietary bits,
which are nearly always the bits you actually need, i.e. the ADSL
and VDSL2 latest formats.


The HH5A is the third router I've used openWRT/LEDE on, and as you say
it is the first where the xDSL interface is supported natively, before
I've had to use dual ethernet router with an xDSL modem in bridge mode.

I think it only supports G.inp in one direction, so if you have a long
line, or electrically noisy neighbours you could have an issue, but for
me it is faster than an billion 8800NL was

Status: UP
Line State: showtime_tc_sync [0x801]
Line Mode: G.993.2 (VDSL2)
Annex: B
Profile: 17a
Data Rate: 79.810 Mb/s / 19.999 Mb/s
Max. Attainable Data Rate (ATTNDR): 79.921 Mb/s / 28.058 Mb/s
Latency: 0.20 ms / 0.0 ms
Line Attenuation (LATN): 11.1 dB / 12.5 dB
Signal Attenuation (SATN): 11.3 dB / 12.6 dB
Noise Margin (SNR): 5.9 dB / 15.2 dB
Aggregate Transmit Power(ACTATP): 0.7 dB / 14.1 dB

It's a super little router.


OK, I'm probably going to try going down this route then. Even if I
brick it I'm no worse off (currently using the TP-Link TD-W9980 which
is OK'ish but not ideal).

--
Chris Green

  #6  
Old June 19th 17, 09:55 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chronos wrote:
On Sun, 18 Jun 2017 21:59:14 +0100
Andy Burns wrote:

Chris Green wrote:

Can anyone recommend a VDSL2/FTTC router which has a firewall that
works and doesn't cost an arm and a leg?


Stick LEDE on the plusnet hub zero ...


I've been saying this since he last asked. I'm loath to suggest it
again lest I sound like a broken record.


See my comments elsewhere in the thread. However I am becoming more
interested in the idea. How difficult are the required hardware
modifications? I have looked at the LEDE site but it's not
*incredibly* clear what one needs to do.

I have installed OpenWrt on a router so know the basics, however I
just needed to rig up a serial lead to do that, the router (Mikrotik)
had a serial port already.

--
Chris Green

  #7  
Old June 19th 17, 12:14 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chris Green wrote:
Chronos wrote:
On Sun, 18 Jun 2017 21:59:14 +0100
Andy Burns wrote:

Chris Green wrote:

Can anyone recommend a VDSL2/FTTC router which has a firewall that
works and doesn't cost an arm and a leg?

Stick LEDE on the plusnet hub zero ...


I've been saying this since he last asked. I'm loath to suggest it
again lest I sound like a broken record.


See my comments elsewhere in the thread. However I am becoming more
interested in the idea. How difficult are the required hardware
modifications? I have looked at the LEDE site but it's not
*incredibly* clear what one needs to do.

I have installed OpenWrt on a router so know the basics, however I
just needed to rig up a serial lead to do that, the router (Mikrotik)
had a serial port already.

Installing OpenWrt/LEDE on the HH5A doesn't look as if it's for the
faint-hearted:-

https://wiki.openwrt.org/toh/bt/homehub_v5a

Not to mention that the .bin file it suggests using says:-

This branch is 4 commits ahead, 2316 commits behind
lede-project:master.

As I said I'm not really convinced about LEDE/OpenWrt being a sensible
way to go.

--
Chris Green

  #8  
Old June 19th 17, 07:48 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 268
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chronos wrote:

I build my own from bleeding edge source


Did you enable dual CPU, the second eth (WAN) port, or both?

  #9  
Old June 19th 17, 06:23 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 268
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Chris Green wrote:

How difficult are the required hardware
modifications?


Piggle the case open with two or three spudgers

Solder four fine wires to solder pads (they don't need to be pretty,
aren't especially close to other pads, once you've uploaded the firmware
over serial, their job is done (future upgrades are over ethernet/wifi)

I have looked at the LEDE site but it's not
*incredibly* clear what one needs to do.


I can provide a good summary and better photos than the website.

I have installed OpenWrt on a router so know the basics, however I
just needed to rig up a serial lead to do that, the router (Mikrotik)
had a serial port already.


Make sure the USB/TTL serial dongle you have is 3.3V not 5.0V
  #10  
Old June 19th 17, 09:46 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 152
Default ADSL/VDSL routers - are they all total rubbish?

Andy Burns wrote:
Chris Green wrote:

How difficult are the required hardware
modifications?


Piggle the case open with two or three spudgers

OK, easy enough, I have a kit of them.


Solder four fine wires to solder pads (they don't need to be pretty,
aren't especially close to other pads, once you've uploaded the firmware
over serial, their job is done (future upgrades are over ethernet/wifi)

I have looked at the LEDE site but it's not
*incredibly* clear what one needs to do.


I can provide a good summary and better photos than the website.

Could you tell me where or send them to me please, E-Mail in header is
valid if you mail them.


I have installed OpenWrt on a router so know the basics, however I
just needed to rig up a serial lead to do that, the router (Mikrotik)
had a serial port already.


Make sure the USB/TTL serial dongle you have is 3.3V not 5.0V


That might be an issue, for the Mikrotik I used my 'real' COM port on
the desktop machine. I guess USB-Serial dongles are two a penny on
eBay though.

Thanks in advance for any/all information (and so far!).

--
Chris Green

 




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