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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

'More than half' of UK households face broadband problems



 
 
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  #11  
Old April 3rd 18, 05:50 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 501
Default 'More than half' of UK households face broadband problems

On Monday, 2 April 2018 23:40:23 UTC+1, 7 wrote:
Java Jive wrote:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43617492

"One in five British households have experienced slow broadband speeds
in the last year, according to Which.

A similar number have had connection dropouts and router problems, the
consumer rights group added.

It polled more than 1,900 customers across 12 providers, more than half
of whom reported having problems with their broadband service or price.

Which said providers had "a long way to go" to meet customer expectations.

The survey looked at the biggest providers, including BT, Sky, TalkTalk,
Virgin Media and Zen Internet. Together they serve about 90% of UK
broadband customers."



I loose connectivity several times a day now with "broadband Internet"

Not likely to happen with 20x cheaper and 20x faster to roll out
"symmetric gigabit fiber Internet".

Two tower blocks some 300 yards away got it. But I can't have it
because I don't own a tower block

Waat a fscking mess!!


You should contact Hyperoptic - they can install fibre anywhere for a pittance or so some whacko who posts in this group keeps saying...

I do live in a small block, but we can't even have cable because we only own our part of the road and they [Virgin] can't dig it up without permission.

Still 50Mbps meets my needs 99% of the time.
  #12  
Old April 3rd 18, 09:19 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
stephen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 381
Default 'More than half' of UK households face broadband problems

On Mon, 2 Apr 2018 22:39:35 +0100, "NY" wrote:

"Woody" wrote in message
news

"Java Jive" wrote in message
news
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-43617492

"One in five British households have experienced slow broadband speeds in
the last year, according to Which.

A similar number have had connection dropouts and router problems, the
consumer rights group added.

It polled more than 1,900 customers across 12 providers, more than half
of whom reported having problems with their broadband service or price.

Which said providers had "a long way to go" to meet customer
expectations.

The survey looked at the biggest providers, including BT, Sky, TalkTalk,
Virgin Media and Zen Internet. Together they serve about 90% of UK
broadband customers."



The interesting point there was that VM had the highest level of
complaints, and as most of their feed is on cable which is inherently
reliable and fast, the complaints were mainly around cost.

I doubt many of the others were about cost maybe with the exception of Zen
who charge more but do give exceptional service.


Is there any evidence that different ISPs that use the same communication
method (eg BT lines, which are not LLU) are different for a given line.


Yes

Is
contention per line or per ISP:


Yes - both. There is some in BT Openreach and then further choke
points deeper into the network.

FTTC can be hooked up to the ISP backhaul at the "group exchange"
level using GEA
- once that happens you are on the specific ISPs plumbing and subject
to whatever contention / pipe size they use for the backhaul and no of
users

Also not all FTTC is used for ISP Internet connections - some is for
private networking, and probably other stuff I dont get involved with.

if at any instant a given line was connected
via ISP1 would it get different speed compared to if at that same instant it
was connected via ISP2?


This is a different question - ie what sync speed do you get from the
combination of line, filter, customer end router and line profile.
- but yes the ISP gets to tinker with some settings
- the home end components can make some difference.
- and some home routers seem to struggle with just forwarding at
higher bandwidths

Are you contending with the other nearby users of
the same ISP or with all the users of BT lines in your area, irrespective of
ISP?


Both.
The DSLAM may have internal contention between the DSL line cards and
the Ethernet links into the BT OR local LAN.
BT Openreach install some layer 2 switching between the FTTC DSLAM and
the exchange handover, which may involve backhaul to a parent exchange
- handover is at 1G or 10G.
- each FTTC connection is stitched through as a VLAN.

If the ISP handover is at that site then you are then off BT plumbing,
otherwise you may get backhauled to a central BT interconnect.
- that handoff will be Ethernet and there is the room to contend
traffic there.

Given the aggregate DSL capacity of a big ISP is n x 1 million
circuits of say 20 Mbps+ on average and the handover to LINX and other
exchanges will be a lot less than the aggregate, ISP internal design
has to have contention somewhere......

My experience of slow ADSL is that it is limited by the sync speed that
depends on your line length, and doesn't deteriorate further at different
times of day. indeed contention seems to be more noticeable on lines with a
faster sync speed because there is then greater variation between best and
worst, whereas for slow lines, the line is consistently slow and the
rate-limiting step is the sync speed rather than the data throughput speed.

ADSL contention is likely small in FTTC enabled exchanges since
connections are migrating off it and i dont see much leverage in
reducing bandwidth on the old backhaul connections.
Non FTTC / FTTP locations will be different.

BT OR have some prioritisation in place to try to limit the low end
performance impact of users on each other in FTTC, but it is a simple
2 level priority scheme - it pretty much has to be simple to not need
manual tinkering, to be easy to use and to scale.

BT publish "SINs" or supplier info notes about how they put bits of
the network together.
https://www.btplc.com/SINet/SINs/index.htm

Some of the FTTC complexities are in
https://www.btplc.com/SINet/SINs/pdf/498v7p3.pdf

I was surprised to find that one housing estate in a medium-size town
(everyone who connects by a given cabinet) cannot get FTTC because that
cabinet has not been upgraded, although people a few streets away on a
different cabinet to the same exchange can get it. And BT's official report
for the first cabinet is "investigating ways of bringing FTTC to this
address, with no plans or forecast as to when/if this will happen" (I've
paraphrased a little). You'd think in a town, all the cabinets of an
exchnage that has been enabled for FTTC would appear on the same plan, with
approximate dates when each cabinet will be upgraded. The two cases are both
real cabinets: one is not a pseudo cabinet near the exchange to provide FTTC
for lines which go directly to the exchange rather than by a cabinet.

The problem with FTTC comes with a long ribbon development of isolated
houses along a road. I had to investigate exceptionally slow ADSL to a house
on such a road, and everyone had been told that wherever BT put an FTTC
cabinet, most of the houses would be too far away from it to make VDSL work,
so BT's answer was not to install FTTC at all :-(


BT OR may be looking at some ways to infill
- 1 talked about was a mini DSLAM wih lower fanout (and cost) that
could be mounted on a telegraph pole

fixed radio access may help if there is somewhere with a good
"footprint" such as TV or radio mast (as they nicked all the best
locations a long time ago)
- one of the touted uses for 5G at high frequencies and bandwidths
is doing the same from a pole or lamppost, although not much has been
talked about for UK use yet, and that may need external antennas to
work.

an alternate way to avoid the copper limitations is use FTTP, where 1
duct or overhead cable daisychain can be run to pick up widely spaced
properties

--
Stephen
  #13  
Old April 3rd 18, 09:24 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Vir Campestris
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 218
Default 'More than half' of UK households face broadband problems

On 02/04/2018 22:39, NY wrote:
The problem with FTTC comes with a long ribbon development of isolated
houses along a road. I had to investigate exceptionally slow ADSL to a
house
on such a road, and everyone had been told that wherever BT put an FTTC
cabinet, most of the houses would be too far away from it to make VDSL
work,
so BT's answer was not to install FTTC at all :-(


fx waves

BT slipped year on year for us, at least 3 years that I know of, until
one of the villagers put the work in and we started setting up our own
wireless system that would be in competition with BT.

Suddenly it all became possible. Some of us even have FTTP.

Andy
 




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