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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

VDSL VLAN tag question



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 2nd 18, 05:51 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J[_2_]
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Posts: 710
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.

Can anybody explain what this actually does?

I want to use a Vigor 2830 (which does not support VDSL) so I will
connect its WAN2 port to an Ethernet modem that does support VDSL.
Question: should I set the VLAN tag to 101 on the WAN2 port?

--
Graham J


  #2  
Old November 2nd 18, 06:17 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 283
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Graham J wrote:

Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.

Can anybody explain what this actually does?


openreach can supply multiple VLANs within the PPPoE session, e.g. I
believe if you have BT Sport channels they are multicast on a separate
VLAN, it's bad form to use VLAN=1 for real traffic, so I guess somebody
in Martlesham chose 101.
  #3  
Old November 2nd 18, 06:21 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 283
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Andy Burns wrote:

openreach can supply multiple VLANs within the PPPoE session


Or more likely the PPP is within one VLAN over the E, IYSWIM?
  #4  
Old November 2nd 18, 06:42 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Java Jive
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Posts: 344
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

On 02/11/2018 16:51, Graham J wrote:

Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.


Is it? I have no experience of VDSL specifically, but ...
VLAN = Virtual LAN
.... would not normally be expected to have any relevance to the WAN side
of the router, and, accordingly, in the 2830 the VLAN settings are in
the LAN subsection of the main menu on the LHS of the web configuration
page. Do you really mean VLAN?

Can anybody explain what this actually does?


A VLAN is used to allow different networks over the same hardware,
whether that be cables or WiFi Access points.

Suppose I have two types of people accessing my LAN, regular users who
need to access all the servers and other devices on the LAN, and guest
users who just need to access the internet. You'd set up two VLANs,
which would use different subnets, say 192.168.1.0 and 192.168.2.0, and
thus be isolated from each other. To enable this to happen the 2630 &
2860 routers both allow you to differentiate between VLANs by plugging
them into different LAN ports, but to separate WiFi clients into
separate VLANs, you need to be able to set a VLAN tag according to the
SSID that a given client is accessing by, and I don't believe this is
possible with the WiFi on either the 2630 or the 2860, but it is
possible with DVAP910C access points plugged into either router.

I want to use a Vigor 2830 (which does not support VDSL) so I will
connect its WAN2 port to an Ethernet modem that does support VDSL.
Question: should I set the VLAN tag to 101 on the WAN2 port?


If you have a choice, the 2860 is the more modern and better router, why
do you wish to use the older 2630 model?
  #5  
Old November 2nd 18, 06:56 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 283
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Java Jive wrote:

I have no experience of VDSL specifically,
Do you really mean VLAN?


Yes he does, it's used in a similar way to the VPI=0/VCI=38 for
openreach PPPoA with ADSL, IIRC some of the unbunbdled providers
(Be/bulldog) used different values.

Theoretically allowing multiple virtual circuits, but I highly doubt you
could ever order two different ISP connections over a single line.
  #6  
Old November 3rd 18, 12:23 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J[_2_]
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Posts: 710
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Andy Burns wrote:
Java Jive wrote:

I have no experience of VDSL specifically,
Do you really mean VLAN?


Yes he does, it's used in a similar way to the VPI=0/VCI=38 for
openreach PPPoA with ADSL, IIRC some of the unbunbdled providers
(Be/bulldog) used different values.

Theoretically allowing multiple virtual circuits, but I highly doubt you
could ever order two different ISP connections over a single line.


Thank you. My information came from the Draytek instructions, so
presumably it's done for a purpose. In fact I have a hazy memory of
configuring an early 2860 without the VLAN tag and getting some very
strange behaviour; and having to get the SEG technical support people to
find the instructions for the VLAN tag setting which were not at that
time part of the standard documentation.

Logically, multiple ISP connections ought to be possible over a single
line; but given that the line itself is the bandwidth-limiting factor
there would be very little point.

--
Graham J

  #7  
Old November 3rd 18, 11:18 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Chris Green
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Posts: 155
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Java Jive wrote:
On 02/11/2018 16:51, Graham J wrote:

Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.


Is it? I have no experience of VDSL specifically, but ...
VLAN = Virtual LAN
... would not normally be expected to have any relevance to the WAN side
of the router, and, accordingly, in the 2830 the VLAN settings are in
the LAN subsection of the main menu on the LHS of the web configuration
page. Do you really mean VLAN?

Can anybody explain what this actually does?


A VLAN is used to allow different networks over the same hardware,
whether that be cables or WiFi Access points.

Suppose I have two types of people accessing my LAN, regular users who
need to access all the servers and other devices on the LAN, and guest
users who just need to access the internet. You'd set up two VLANs,
which would use different subnets, say 192.168.1.0 and 192.168.2.0, and
thus be isolated from each other. To enable this to happen the 2630 &
2860 routers both allow you to differentiate between VLANs by plugging
them into different LAN ports, but to separate WiFi clients into
separate VLANs, you need to be able to set a VLAN tag according to the
SSID that a given client is accessing by, and I don't believe this is
possible with the WiFi on either the 2630 or the 2860, but it is
possible with DVAP910C access points plugged into either router.

The 2860n can certainly separate WiFi LANs on different SSIDs. In the
VLAN configuration you can assign SSIDs as well a LAN ports to each
VLAN.

--
Chris Green

  #8  
Old November 3rd 18, 03:14 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Alfred[_2_]
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Posts: 11
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Graham J wrote:
Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.

Can anybody explain what this actually does?

I want to use a Vigor 2830 (which does not support VDSL) so I will
connect its WAN2 port to an Ethernet modem that does support VDSL.
Question: should I set the VLAN tag to 101 on the WAN2 port?


Are you using LEDE/OpenWRT?

I use a similar setup with a BT home hub with OpenWRT and an Openreach
modem for VDSL (FTTC) over othernet connected to the WAN port.

config interface 'wan'
option _orig_ifname 'eth0'
option _orig_bridge 'false'
option ifname 'eth0.2'
option proto 'pppoe'
option username '
option password 'XXXX'
option ipv6 'auto'

I don't need to set any other special option.

I think the 101 tag is only when you use the internal modem for ADSL
(possibly also for VDSL). For the setup with internal modem I used
network.wan.ifname='ptm0.101'

For configuring the hardest thing was guessing the WAN interface name
'eth0.2'. 'ifconfig -a' in the LEDE CLI didn't show it, but eth0.2
appeared on the web LEDE portal for WAN.
  #9  
Old November 3rd 18, 04:52 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham J[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 710
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Alfred wrote:

[snip]

I think the 101 tag is only when you use the internal modem for ADSL
(possibly also for VDSL). For the setup with internal modem I used
network.wan.ifname='ptm0.101'


[snip]

The Vigor V2860 instructions say that the VLAN tag value of 101 is
required for VDSL (but not for ADSL) when using the internal modem.

Probably tomorrow I will test this with an external modem on a V2860 and
a V2830, and will report back.

A relative has a V2830 with an Openreach modem connected to the WAN2
port, using VDSL, and this does not require the VLAN tag 101 where the
ISP is Zen Internet. Do you think the requirement may depend on the
ISP, or on the type of modem in use?

--
Graham J



  #10  
Old November 3rd 18, 04:54 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Furniss
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Posts: 55
Default VDSL VLAN tag question

Graham J wrote:
Using a Vigor 2860 router with WAN1 connected to a VDSL service, it is
necessary to enable the VLAN tag with value=101.

Can anybody explain what this actually does?


It's talked of in some bt sin IIRC.

I want to use a Vigor 2830 (which does not support VDSL) so I will
connect its WAN2 port to an Ethernet modem that does support VDSL.
Question: should I set the VLAN tag to 101 on the WAN2 port?


No it's a modem/openreach thing.
 




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