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uk.telecom.broadband (UK broadband) (uk.telecom.broadband) Discussion of broadband services, technology and equipment as provided in the UK. Discussions of specific services based on ADSL, cable modems or other broadband technology are also on-topic. Advertising is not allowed.

Interesting Conundrum



 
 
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  #1  
Old November 16th 19, 02:53 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Java Jive
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Posts: 586
Default Interesting Conundrum

If, which I doubt, any of you have followed the shenanigens of our
broadband here in Shinness, and our various attempts to improve it, you
may be aware that we now have a shiny new green FTTC cabinet at the
junction of the A838 and Tirryside at 256544,910287:


As a result, two local households within a few hundred yards have
reported that their ADSL broadband has increased in speed and
reliability so much that feel no need to actually ask for FTTC! That's
a little surprising, but perhaps while they were laying the fibre for
the cabinet they also laid new copper back to the exchange, so removed a
lot of the faults caused by lightning making the wires brittle, etc.
Even so, and even though they are among the closest houses to the
exchange, they are still about 5.7km from it, so, according to this
graph, I wouldn't expect them to be getting more than about 2Mbps:

https://www.increasebroadbandspeed.c...ersus-distance

Perhaps they are happy with a reliable 2Mbps (I was walking by at the
time, and didn't think to ask them their speeds, and I don't have emails
for either household, so would have to ring up or bang on doors to get
better details, which I may well yet do), or, just possibly, have BT
switched everyone, or at least all *their* customers, on that cabinet
over to FTTC silently without extra charge? This sounds unlikely, but,
certainly they've switched all but about six local lines to go via that
cabinet, because I've checked every local number that I've been given as
contact details, and read on, there is even stranger news!

Next, yesterday, a household that is 8.24km from the exchange and 2.84km
away from the cabinet - comfortably more than the usually recommended
2km cut-off distance of viability of FTTC over ADSL - called me in for
a chat as I walking past, so I had to stand on the front door mat in my
dirty boots, and couldn't see any of the emails they had exchanged, and
of course their verbal description was vague and non-technical, but I
gathered they'd recently rung up BT to complain, threatening to take
their custom elsewhere. BT offered them a 'booster' service, came to
the premises and installed something, I think at the top of their pole,
and now they're getting 20Mbps!

Er, how? According to this, they shouldn't be getting more than about
10Mbps at very best, and the intervening cabling is so bad that it
featured in more than one of the negligence pictures that I posted a day
or so ago in R Mark Clayton's thread:

https://www.increasebroadbandspeed.c...ainst-distance

Could BT have improved the FTTC service to work so dramatically well at
that distance over multiply f*ked-up cabling, or, as the household are
getting exactly the same as me on a 4G service, have BT simply installed
some sort of 4G receiver at the top of their pole, without explaining
that they are no longer using a landline?

A related factor may be the opening of Highland Wireless' new system in
the area, I am beginning to suspect from the above that BT are trying to
undermine their business venture, and the above being part of it?

Any thoughts?
  #2  
Old November 16th 19, 03:38 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Roger
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Posts: 47
Default Interesting Conundrum

On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 14:53:18 +0000, Java Jive
wrote:

[snip lots and lots]

Any thoughts?


Does an ADSL modem work with FTTC? I thought one needed a VDSL
modem. Some boxes do both, of course.

Here's a sneaky idea. Put a telephone number in the following
and, if the line is supplied by Openreach, you should see
observed speeds. I don't know how often it updates; mine is
currently showing 6th November.

https://www.dslchecker.bt.com/adsl/adslchecker.welcome
--
Roger
  #3  
Old November 16th 19, 09:25 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Vir Campestris
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Posts: 282
Default Interesting Conundrum

On 16/11/2019 19:22, Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd wrote:
FTTC prices are now essentially the same as ADSL for lowest speed, although
Openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice only use where
there is no copper and no need for broadband.


We've got FTTP, and BT are unable to migrate incoming calls to the POTS
port on the fibre modem.

We effectively have 2 outgoing lines - if I had another phone I'd be
tempted to see if the modem line could call the POTS one.

Andy

  #4  
Old November 16th 19, 10:32 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Bob Eager[_5_]
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Posts: 89
Default Interesting Conundrum

On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 21:25:32 +0000, Vir Campestris wrote:

On 16/11/2019 19:22, Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd wrote:
FTTC prices are now essentially the same as ADSL for lowest speed,
although Openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice
only use where there is no copper and no need for broadband.


We've got FTTP, and BT are unable to migrate incoming calls to the POTS
port on the fibre modem.

We effectively have 2 outgoing lines - if I had another phone I'd be
tempted to see if the modem line could call the POTS one.


Get a VoIP adapter and migrate the phone number to an ITSP.
  #5  
Old November 17th 19, 03:09 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Graham.[_3_]
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Posts: 340
Default Interesting Conundrum

On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 21:25:32 +0000, Vir Campestris wrote:

On 16/11/2019 19:22, Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd wrote:
FTTC prices are now essentially the same as ADSL for lowest speed,
although Openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice
only use where there is no copper and no need for broadband.


We've got FTTP, and BT are unable to migrate incoming calls to the POTS
port on the fibre modem.

We effectively have 2 outgoing lines - if I had another phone I'd be
tempted to see if the modem line could call the POTS one.


Get a VoIP adapter and migrate the phone number to an ITSP.


As well as that Andy, even if the VoIP port on your router worked,
AIUI BT charge the same rates for outgoing calls as they would for a
genuine POTS line. If you roll your own VoIP as suggested, you can pay
considerably less for calls, in my case 0.3p/min to call a UK mobile,
and no "connection charge" added to the first min.

With our current usage I pay 10 to my voip provider about every 3
months, my landline provider offers all I can eat for an additional 8
per month which is nearly 150% more


--
Graham.

%Profound_observation%
  #6  
Old November 17th 19, 06:31 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 131
Default Interesting Conundrum

*Subject:* Interesting Conundrum
*From:* Java Jive
*Date:* Sat, 16 Nov 2019 14:53:18 +0000

If, which I doubt, any of you have followed the shenanigens of
our broadband here in Shinness, and our various attempts to
improve it, you may be aware that we now have a shiny new green
FTTC cabinet
As a result, two local households within a few hundred yards have
reported that their ADSL broadband has increased in speed and
reliability so much that feel no need to actually ask for FTTC!


Technically, it's possible for the FTTC cabinet to contain an MSAN
(multi-service access node) which supports voice, ADSL and VDSL, this is how
some suppliers provide ADSL and voice from the exchange.
Since BT already had two of these services from the exchange, most cabinets
only used VDSL.

In which case ADSL speed would have increased since the copper between the
exchange and cabinet is now obsolete. This is the Openreach plan for the next
few years when the existing telephone exchanges are turned off, for those
without FTTP.

Maybe they are testing it early?

FTTC prices are now essentially the same as ADSL for lowest speed, although
Openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice only use where
there is no copper and no need for broadband.

Angus
  #7  
Old November 17th 19, 10:03 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Andy Burns[_5_]
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Posts: 555
Default Interesting Conundrum

Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd wrote:

openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice only use where
there is no copper and no need for broadband.


I wondered if the 0.5Mbps FTTP was for Jeremy's communist broadband :-P
  #8  
Old November 17th 19, 11:27 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
NY[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 93
Default Interesting Conundrum

"Andy Burns" wrote in message
...
Angus Robertson - Magenta Systems Ltd wrote:

openreach is planning an FTTP product with 500K/500K for voice only use
where
there is no copper and no need for broadband.


I wondered if the 0.5Mbps FTTP was for Jeremy's communist broadband :-P


A sort of Trabant or Lada class of internet ;-)

  #9  
Old November 17th 19, 11:54 AM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
Roderick Stewart
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Posts: 625
Default Interesting Conundrum

On Sat, 16 Nov 2019 15:38:14 +0000, Roger
wrote:

Does an ADSL modem work with FTTC? I thought one needed a VDSL
modem. Some boxes do both, of course.


I wouldn't recommend buying one that didn't do both, even if you're
only using ADSL for now, in case you have the opportunity to upgrade
to VDSL later.

A common arrangement is now a modem, router and wireless access point
all in the same box (a "hub"), so if you needed to buy a new one you'd
be buying all of that all over again even though it was only the modem
part that was different. Buy the right thing and only buy it once.

Rod.
  #10  
Old November 17th 19, 12:28 PM posted to uk.telecom.broadband
NY[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 93
Default Interesting Conundrum

"Roderick Stewart" wrote in message
news
A common arrangement is now a modem, router and wireless access point
all in the same box (a "hub"), so if you needed to buy a new one you'd
be buying all of that all over again even though it was only the modem
part that was different. Buy the right thing and only buy it once.


A combined box has the advantage that it is a single mains plug rather than
several, and that you only need to run telephone cable *smaller-diameter
round able) to the place where you want it.

Separate boxes are modular: you can replace just the modem (if you upgrade
from ADSL to VDSL or even to FTTP), and you can site the wireless access
point so as to give best wifi coverage in the house. However you need to run
Cat 5/6/7 cable between the boxes. Until recently this was larger-diameter
round cable (harder to hide down the edge of carpets and to fit under metal
carpet strips in the doorway between one door and another. However recently
flat cable has become available which is easy to fit under the edge of a
carpet and under a carpet strip; the only problem is when you want to turn
through 90 degrees, you need to allow for the cable standing up on end at
the bend.

 




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