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uk.telecom.voip (UK VOIP) (uk.telecom.voip) Discussion of topics relevant to packet based voice technologies including Voice over IP (VoIP), Fax over IP (FoIP), Voice over Frame Relay (VoFR), Voice over Broadband (VoB) and Voice on the Net (VoN) as well as service providers, hardware and software for use with these technologies. Advertising is not allowed.

Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT



 
 
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  #1  
Old August 4th 18, 07:38 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
Graham.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT



When calling an EU country the price you pay per minute depends on the
CLID of the calling party, those with non EU numbers now pay a premium
on some clones.

For example using voipcheap.co.uk to call a French mobile


France (Mobile) £ 0.012 £ 0.014
France [non-EU-callerid] (Mobile) £ 0.020 £ 0.024

https://www.voipcheap.co.uk/calling_rates/
and select an EU destination, or click "all rates"

The same mechanism for the differential is ready to be implemented on
the other clones. The UK is conspicuous by not having any
differentials.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%
  #2  
Old August 4th 18, 09:16 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
Theo[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 57
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

Graham. wrote:


When calling an EU country the price you pay per minute depends on the
CLID of the calling party, those with non EU numbers now pay a premium
on some clones.


That seems to be related to this:
https://highside.net/origin-based-surcharging-eea/

I don't see it on other sites, but the source for dialcheap is a bit odd -
there's a div labelled 'modal-not-nl-landen' which says:
"For this destination, the following countries are considered E.U. member
states."
and lists the EU28. But there's another one labelled 'modal-nl-landen'
which has a list of 76 countries as EU member states (including countries
like Brunei, Mongolia and Venezuela). I'm not sure the circumstances in
which it shows this extra-enlarged EU.

Theo
  #3  
Old August 5th 18, 12:37 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 485
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

On Saturday, 4 August 2018 19:37:57 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
When calling an EU country the price you pay per minute depends on the
CLID of the calling party, those with non EU numbers now pay a premium
on some clones.

For example using voipcheap.co.uk to call a French mobile


France (Mobile) £ 0.012 £ 0.014
France [non-EU-callerid] (Mobile) £ 0.020 £ 0.024

https://www.voipcheap.co.uk/calling_rates/
and select an EU destination, or click "all rates"

The same mechanism for the differential is ready to be implemented on
the other clones. The UK is conspicuous by not having any
differentials.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%


I think you or voipcheap are getting confused here. I think the issue is French overseas departments in south America and the Caribbean. Actually they are both in France and in the EU, but unlike say Gibraltar or the Channel Islands (which are British, in the EU, but not in the UK) they are not in Europe, but thousands of miles away.
  #4  
Old August 5th 18, 01:36 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
Graham.[_3_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 226
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

On Saturday, 4 August 2018 19:37:57 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
When calling an EU country the price you pay per minute depends on the
CLID of the calling party, those with non EU numbers now pay a premium
on some clones.

For example using voipcheap.co.uk to call a French mobile


France (Mobile) £ 0.012 £ 0.014
France [non-EU-callerid] (Mobile) £ 0.020 £ 0.024

https://www.voipcheap.co.uk/calling_rates/
and select an EU destination, or click "all rates"

The same mechanism for the differential is ready to be implemented on
the other clones. The UK is conspicuous by not having any
differentials.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%


I think you or voipcheap are getting confused here. I think the issue is French overseas departments in south America and the Caribbean. Actually they are both in France and in the EU, but unlike say Gibraltar or the Channel Islands (which are British, in the EU, but not in the UK) they are not in Europe, but thousands of miles away.


Well I'm certainly perplexed, no argument there.

France and voipcheap.co.uk were just given as an example.

AFAICS all the "Betamax" clones now have dual listings for all EU
destinations, (except to the UK oddly), although in many cases the
prices are equal
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%
  #5  
Old August 6th 18, 10:46 AM posted to uk.telecom.voip
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 485
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

On Sunday, 5 August 2018 13:38:39 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
On Saturday, 4 August 2018 19:37:57 UTC+1, Graham. wrote:
When calling an EU country the price you pay per minute depends on the
CLID of the calling party, those with non EU numbers now pay a premium
on some clones.

For example using voipcheap.co.uk to call a French mobile


France (Mobile) £ 0.012 £ 0.014
France [non-EU-callerid] (Mobile) £ 0.020 £ 0.024

https://www.voipcheap.co.uk/calling_rates/
and select an EU destination, or click "all rates"

The same mechanism for the differential is ready to be implemented on
the other clones. The UK is conspicuous by not having any
differentials.
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%


I think you or voipcheap are getting confused here. I think the issue is French overseas departments in south America and the Caribbean. Actually they are both in France and in the EU, but unlike say Gibraltar or the Channel Islands (which are British, in the EU, but not in the UK) they are not in Europe, but thousands of miles away.


Well I'm certainly perplexed, no argument there.

France and voipcheap.co.uk were just given as an example.

AFAICS all the "Betamax" clones now have dual listings for all EU
destinations, (except to the UK oddly), although in many cases the
prices are equal
--

Graham.
%Profound_observation%


Perhaps they are getting ready for a hard Brexit, although international telephony is regulated by the ITU (part of the UN) not the EU.
  #6  
Old August 6th 18, 12:52 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
Theo[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 57
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

R. Mark Clayton wrote:
Perhaps they are getting ready for a hard Brexit, although international
telephony is regulated by the ITU (part of the UN) not the EU.


As I posted, it's related to this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe...price_lim its

Intra-EU calls are subject to price caps (for wholesale termination). Calls
from outside the EU aren't.

Therefore a telco has to look at the CLID to see if the call comes from an
EU country and if it is it can't be more than the mandatory interchange rate
(see the second table at that link for the post July 2018 rates).

It seems like Betamax/Dellmont are applying this in a rather heavy-handed
way - heavily surcharging calls from outside the EU to compensate for loss
of revenue on intra-EU calls.

Given that those surcharges are way above what it actually costs for
termination, I suspect it won't be long before somebody else eats their
lunch.

Theo
  #7  
Old August 6th 18, 06:58 PM posted to uk.telecom.voip
R. Mark Clayton[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 485
Default Betamax / Dellmont & BREXIT

On Monday, 6 August 2018 12:52:09 UTC+1, Theo wrote:
R. Mark Clayton wrote:
Perhaps they are getting ready for a hard Brexit, although international
telephony is regulated by the ITU (part of the UN) not the EU.


As I posted, it's related to this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europe...price_lim its

Intra-EU calls are subject to price caps (for wholesale termination). Calls
from outside the EU aren't.

Therefore a telco has to look at the CLID to see if the call comes from an
EU country and if it is it can't be more than the mandatory interchange rate
(see the second table at that link for the post July 2018 rates).

It seems like Betamax/Dellmont are applying this in a rather heavy-handed
way - heavily surcharging calls from outside the EU to compensate for loss
of revenue on intra-EU calls.

Given that those surcharges are way above what it actually costs for
termination, I suspect it won't be long before somebody else eats their
lunch.

Theo


Looks like they are getting ready for the UK out of the EU and can RoB UK customers again as the mobile networks did for decades until the EU created a level playing field.
 




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